Why Linn DS

[tormod]

(2010-12-06 09:37)JohnC Wrote:  The Linn DS is a very good product, how it stands up against the competition only those that have tried different ones will tell and I suspect that in the end it comes down to a preferred way of integrating the storage of your music and the device that it plays it on.

However one thing that is sadly lacking is the lack of user friendly software to make it work.

The basics of digital stored music is sound, however nobody really has looked into the future and how to keep your music intact and able to be used in 10 to 20 years time.

Take a CD, I have many that are years old, I have LP's from the 70's.

Do you think that your NAS is going to be able to stand the test of time without some portability of your music to the latest storage facility. None of this appears on the market for any of the systems that play digital stored music. Nobody has any simple software to transfer your music from one device to another. The playback software for most is ok at best, but not good.

Over the years I have worked in the IT industry and have seen the difficulties in changing the storage of data from one computer to another, the same will apply to your stored music.

The technology to play the music becomes small in comparison to the issues that keeping your stored music safe. For the majority of people most don’t know one end of a computer from another.

That is what developers like Linn, Naim and anyone else involved should be addressing now. Over the short period that the Linn DS has been in production I think we are now on our third preferred storage device.

So I don’t think that the issue is if one digital player is better than another, the issue is getting a good user interface to play your stored music on the device and the storage systems safe for the future.

That is one of the main reasons I have gone back to playing vinyl, not withstanding the fact it sounds better!

JohnC,

I will not enter the user interface part, but the storage part requires some answers.
Linn has by introducing the NAS and raid disks, taking care of 99% of the issue of backup, several disks contain the same data, they will not all stop working at the same time, or what could go wrong:

1. Bout or all disks in a NAS have some common parts, which could case a fault on all the drives in the raid.
2. Thunderstorm and lightning.
3. Virus can be a nasty thing.
4. Break in and fire.

So to be sure a second backup is needed, this backup should also be kept in a different physical location.

Quality on the files, music or pictures kept stored on a NAS or similar for 100 years or more compared to on a CD.
The nice thing with a electronic storage is that every time you turn on the power, it will refresh all the data, so after 100 years the NAS is the same whereas the CD is no longer readable.
It goes without saying that the NAS has been changed several times over 100 years and used on regular basics.

Tormod

[MnM]

(2010-12-06 10:31)tormod Wrote:  There is no different between Linn and the setup you mention with iTunes and a DAC. They are all receiving files in ones and zeros from a computer that must be online. The design on of how they do it is different, but a computer is running somewhere inside the DS, NAS,DAC or MAC to get this to work.

I agree, by getting your files over a network gives the impression that this is not computer-based system, but it is.

A gross oversimplification. In that case, what is a CD or DVD or SACD player? Data storage, a retrieval system, control logic, decompression, digital to analogue conversion. Why shouldn't that be a computer too? A DS has an ethernet port instead of a disc transport, and uses UPnP for control via the network, as well as the remote control that disc players tend to use. It plays a selection of formats, just like a CD/DVD/SACD player.

Definitions of what is a NAS, or what is a computer, are fruitless. Tormod, you need to read up on the Linn Docs web pages, they will answer many of your questions. There is more to it than you seem to think. The DS implementation is vastly different from a mac and a dac. http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/Products

Matt

[benhugh]

I fell for the oldest trick in the Linn book - went on a factory visit as it's near my in-laws and fell in love. Had been very vaguely thinking about a replacement CD player and during the day realised that a network was the solution. Better sound quality and no need to store 2,000+ CDs.

In some ways the reality has been better as I now have a network at home, can access all computer files wirelessly and it's all backed up automatically.

I blame Brian and Alison at Linn - it was their incredibly soft sell that did the job

[MG537]

Throwing in my 2 cents here, I purchased a Linn Sekrit DS because the only other experience I've had with Linn products was a Classik Movie System (along with a pair of 5150 columns and a a 5150 centre speaker and a couple of in wall Linn speakers to complete my surround sound experience). I was blown away at the detail of hearing a few of my old CD's on that system.
I recently traded in the Classik Movie system and purchased my current Sekrit DS along with a couple of B&W in-wall speakers.
I haven't experienced any other hi-fi brands out there, but I go by the saying that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

The only caveat that I have is on the software side. There are many choices out there and it does get confusing at times. For example, why does the Chorus DS server properly display my tags, on my ALAC files, yet Twonky version 4.4.17 (that came with my NAS) screws up the year tag (it alway displays 2000) and never displays the composer tag. Oh and also all these choices on ripping software.

[hcl]

(2010-12-06 11:00)bez Wrote:  I bought a DS purely on the improvement in sound quality over CD.
The bonuses such as very compact music storage on a NAS, playlists, and higher resolution files than Red Book CD were quite secondary.

I can only second. The sound quality alone should be enough(!) and it is!

[neilh]

Quite simple

I have had a completely Linn system for many years (nearly 30) and when my Karik decided not to work needing a new laser after 20 years use then the obvious choice was a DS.

The local Linn dealer assured me that it would be better than my arik/Numerik had been, showed me how to use/control it and the decision was made.

My only regret is not having done it sooner.

[markusp]

I finally broke down and bought a Sneaky DS after trying various different other methods without success. I first used an Apple Airport Xpress along with a Cambridge Audio Dac Magic to replace my Naim CD5i cd player. Loved the ease of picking music so the whole computer music thing was here to stay. next jumped to an Apple TV to partner with the DAC. A little better than the AE plus the family could pick music using the TV interface but music sounded harsh at times. Next picked up a Linn Unidisk SC to act as preamp and DAC. Better still since the Cambridge DAC was removed but things could still sound harsh at times. Next jump was back to Naim with their Supernait which had the integrated DAC. Music was good but bad recordings still sounded harsh. Tried adding a Logitech Squeezebox Touch which is a great product but concluded that the DAC in the Supernait was harsh sounding. Finally borrowed a Sneaky DS from my dealer and quickly sold all my Naim gear after a single weekend. Just added a new Majik-I to the mix and am ecstatic with the results. Easily the best sound I have had in my home to date

[Daves Not Here]

I have grown a large music collection and had been running the digital out of the computer (onkyo pci 90 soundcard with digital out) into my 5103 - sounded very good and the itunes interface is so simple - I was hoping that adding a high quality dac would give me the next level that I was looking for and skip all of the work involved in setting up the linn ds - which I had auditioned a year earlier - and loved, but it was expensive enough that I wanted to keep looking.

When I saw the ayre dac listed as a class a product in this years stereophile list of recommended components I though that it would be the solution. I was able to audition the ds and the ayre qb9 usb dac.

The akurate ds blew it away - not even close.

Now I have an akurate ds.

voila

[tormod]

(2010-12-06 12:56)MnM Wrote:  

(2010-12-06 10:31)tormod Wrote:  There is no different between Linn and the setup you mention with iTunes and a DAC. They are all receiving files in ones and zeros from a computer that must be online. The design on of how they do it is different, but a computer is running somewhere inside the DS, NAS,DAC or MAC to get this to work.

I agree, by getting your files over a network gives the impression that this is not computer-based system, but it is.

A gross oversimplification. In that case, what is a CD or DVD or SACD player? Data storage, a retrieval system, control logic, decompression, digital to analogue conversion. Why shouldn't that be a computer too? A DS has an ethernet port instead of a disc transport, and uses UPnP for control via the network, as well as the remote control that disc players tend to use. It plays a selection of formats, just like a CD/DVD/SACD player.

Definitions of what is a NAS, or what is a computer, are fruitless. Tormod, you need to read up on the Linn Docs web pages, they will answer many of your questions. There is more to it than you seem to think. The DS implementation is vastly different from a mac and a dac. http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/Products

Matt

Matt

Not a gross oversimplification, yes a CD or DVD or a SACD is a fixed media storage. It keeps your media files on a fixed media. You say; Why shouldn't that be a computer too? In the computer language this is considered to be computer peripherals.

Linn DS is receiving the media files from a computer; a NAS has a moving media file storage (hard drive).

A DS receive files in a digital format and convert them to analogue, so do the other ones, how you do things does not change the definition on what you do.

The DS is vastly different you say, not so much as you would like it to be, I would say, but that does not change the quality on the sound.

This Thread should not be a technically discussion about the DS, but to compare sonic quality sound from digital players.

Tormod

[molix]

I do not have a Linn DS player. Two months ago I got my hands on a ex-demo Akurate Kontrol with an inbuilt DAC. My Oppo DVD-player works as a digital source, connected to the AK digitally through spdif. It sounds fantastic. And it gives me the freedom to connect any digital source to my system.

Some day I will upgrade to DS, but with my new setup it's no hurry .o)