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Prices
2012-05-04, 16:07
Post: #71
RE: Prices
(2012-05-04 15:36)Aurumer Wrote:  The main costs will be the contracts with the labels, the infrastructure and staff. All this will be much more expensive in EU/UK then in the US.

Why?

NickP
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Always buy the very best you can afford, or the cheapest; anything else is a compromise, and compromises seldom satisfy.
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2012-05-04, 17:17
Post: #72
RE: Prices
(2012-05-03 14:41)CJMUSIC Wrote:  Thanks for all your comments regarding pricing, we are listening! We’ve read everyone’s posts and hopefully this will answer those questions raised.

We believe that Studio Master is the BEST way to listen to music. This is true whether the album was recorded at 44.1/24 or 192/24. The biggest single influence on the music sounding as good as it can is the bit rate, which is why we do not differentiate prices for albums based on sample rate. We simply bring you the music as it was originally recorded – after all it is not really about numbers and file size, but about the true worth of an album in its purest form.

Despite the general perception to the contrary, there is actually quite a high overhead for labels who want to release music in Studio Master quality. Like Linn, much of the music industry is now realising this is an investment well worth making as it is in their interests for their music to be heard at its best. We have been telling everyone how much you, our customers, are behind Studio Master which is why more labels are coming on board and making that investment to make additional Studio Master content available for you.

We understand the various territory restrictions is frustrating, it is for us too. Linn and other websites, HD Tracks for example, can only sell some label content based on the specific contract allowances with that label. In addition certain albums are only licensed to that label to sell in certain territories. We would absolutely love to be able to offer everything to everyone, but in some cases there are historical contracts in place that prevent this and in other cases exclusive contracts with particular digital providers which prevents all content being made available everywhere. We continue to work with our labels to solve this wherever possible, but in many cases their hands are tied.

Briain, thank you for saying that you don’t mind paying a little extra for Linn’s fantastic service! We have always tended to have slightly higher prices than elsewhere and it is because we want to provide the best service we can. We also want to give back to our artists for the great music they make and are happy that Studio Master means we can pay them better royalties than they would receive from Spotify. We are very keen on re-investment to improve our service so that little bit extra we charge is not wasted. It is spent on making the best new music we can and delivering the best web experience.

i find the points made here broadly reasonable but Linn's current pricing model seems to me to be unsustainable going forward, as it positively encourages users to look to other sites. Furthermore, it misses a commercial point that many companies also get wrong - the opportunity to drive volume sales by cutting prices. Consider, how many sales are Linn losing by sticking with the £18 price? If say the price was £15 I'd likely buy more albums, and not bother with HDTracks. The one purchase I tried from both sites (Diana Krall) was bit-identical, so I am not sold on the idea that Linn would offer a better file, just a much more expensive one. So Linn, look to those companies that have realised the benifit of volume pricing in other sectors, or risk falling by the wayside.
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2012-05-04, 17:17
Post: #73
RE: Prices
(2012-05-04 16:07)NickP Wrote:  
(2012-05-04 15:36)Aurumer Wrote:  The main costs will be the contracts with the labels, the infrastructure and staff. All this will be much more expensive in EU/UK then in the US.

Why?

That's easy, because of a complete other economical system with lower taxes and wages. You can buy nearly everything cheaper in the USA then in europe because the costs to produce products or to offer services are lower.
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2012-05-04, 17:35 (This post was last modified: 2012-05-04 17:36 by NickP.)
Post: #74
RE: Prices
(2012-05-04 17:17)Aurumer Wrote:  
(2012-05-04 16:07)NickP Wrote:  
(2012-05-04 15:36)Aurumer Wrote:  The main costs will be the contracts with the labels, the infrastructure and staff. All this will be much more expensive in EU/UK then in the US.
Why?
That's easy, because of a complete other economical system with lower taxes and wages. You can buy nearly everything cheaper in the USA then in europe because the costs to produce products or to offer services are lower.
The bits are produced once; thereafter, they're copied to one or more data centres from where they are distributed. Those data centres can be anywhere in the world - do you think that Apple's data centres are on Infinite Loop? Local conditions are completely irrelevant to the distribution of data, which is what is under discussion. I do not believe for one moment that the bits I buy from Linn come to me from Waterfoot, in the same way that I doubt that the bits I buy from HDTracks come from their offices in NYC. The distribution costs for Linn and for HDTracks - technically - could be identical because the data could reside in the same data centre.

NickP
KELRDSM, Klouts, Keltiks; Furman Elite-16 PF Ei
LP12, Lingo, Ekos, Arkiv-B in storage.

Always buy the very best you can afford, or the cheapest; anything else is a compromise, and compromises seldom satisfy.
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2012-05-04, 17:41
Post: #75
RE: Prices
Yes they could, but the chance that Linn's data recides in UK is much higher.

And the people who manage the sales, website etc. will be in the UK too, also quality control, support, etc.

Don't get me wrong, I am on the oppinion that every download has to be cheaper than the physical mediums, but I agree that Linn may have some higher costs then HDTracks.
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2012-05-04, 18:09 (This post was last modified: 2012-05-04 18:13 by SaltyDog.)
Post: #76
RE: Prices
I buy from different sources. Most of my money ends up with the guy selling at the lower price. The cost of production are what they are. Clicking the put in my cart button is what generates money. The Wal-Mart model and one size fits all will bring more sales. The music is the same no matter the system that's used for playback. The money is going to be made by whoever sells to the masses. The sales to audiophiles being seen as the target group might have been the way to start, but most surely the sales to the masses will generate more cash flow. Now is the time to beat the others to the punch.

My suggestion is $9.99 in the studio master format. One format only. Toss in a program that will down grade to whatever format is desired. Saves on hosting different formats. Pass the savings on. Beat iTunes - what do they know about music? The delivery system is in place.

It takes no special skills to sell the music. Making it does. You have moved on from just selling your own productions.

Try this for 30-days. Compare revenue generated vs. profit margin.


10,000 x $9.99 is more than 1,000 x $24.00. Promise.
Is it a matter of cost per download, or cost per unit of time in operation (support payroll)? The costs per unit of time are a given, so the click the put it in my basket button frequency is the variable.

Not much
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2012-05-05, 02:21
Post: #77
RE: Prices
Here's a pricing model one can live with: Neil Young's upcoming Americana

$12.99 16/44.1 FLAC
$13.99 CD
$39.98 2 LP set

And, dare I say, Oh Susannah is ROCKING!!

Boring stuff->Linn Blacks->More boring stuff
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2012-05-05, 09:15
Post: #78
RE: Prices
I guess the comment about £ being stronger than $ is a typo and it was meant the other way round.

But we shouldn't be surprised. Linn's entire business model is based on selling 'premium' products at 'premium' prices. See all the threads on does the xxx really cost that much to make etc. Linn are simply not in the mass sales biz.

This is compounded of course by the entertainment industry's paranoia about losing control of their markets. Hence all the DRM nonsense and regional coding etc. The industry is convinced that total revenues are higher by keeping markets separate and charging what each will individually bear rather than a single one price fits all.

There are few remedies I fear. In the EU it should be posisble to insist on a single market, but somehow the industry has got away with not even doing that. Maybe the overpaid eurocrats in Brussels could get off their expense paid behinds and do something useful for once?

For me £18 for an album is way too high. I'd rather buy a CD. (But I am old school and rather lke the idea of a physical product that is definitely mine and can't disappear into some IT black hole in a puff of bits).

I'd probably pay a modest increase over CD (maybe £1) for more bits, just as I will buy Blu Ray over DVD (but only when the release price reduces to something sensible), but 50% more? No way.

JMHO etc.

LP12 + Akurate stuff.
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2012-05-05, 10:55 (This post was last modified: 2012-05-05 10:57 by NickP.)
Post: #79
RE: Prices
(2012-05-04 17:41)Aurumer Wrote:  I agree that Linn may have some higher costs then HDTracks.

Quite; but the two main counter-arguments to the iniquity of identical products being priced so differently are both shown not entirely to hold up to scrutiny:

1) "Value to the purchaser"
"The Studio Master - whatever that may be, in the context of a reissue - is the very best that can be obtained, and so is of high value to the purchaser who is therefore prepared to pay more." True, but avoids the central issue, which is, why should the recording's value be 50% higher when downloaded from Linn Records than from HDTracks, or other? The products are identical; what value to me is added by Linn Records over that added by HDTracks?

2) "It costs more to do it in the UK than elsewhere"
Many industries have been hollowed out because they thought their customers would buy this argument, along with their product. And that was in industries where there was a non-trivial direct marginal cost! Here, the marginal cost is vanishingly small; moreover, it is totally feasible for the product actually to be delivered from the same "warehouse", regardless of the shop front that takes the purchase. Are you really suggesting that, if you were able to get a product that is identical in every single respect, including the attendant services, that you would buy they one priced 50% higher just because the producer had higher costs (absent ethical concerns)? Honestly?

To illustrate just what a monster this whole area is for those who think that data is a conventional good, consider this quote from a discussion on sharing paid-for files:

"After I've stolen it, it's still there."

N
(2012-05-04 17:41)Aurumer Wrote:  Yes they could, but the chance that Linn's data recides in UK is much higher.

And the people who manage the sales, website etc. will be in the UK too, also quality control, support, etc.

Remember: this thread is about reissues, where the product is identical, yet priced wildly differently for different people.

NickP
KELRDSM, Klouts, Keltiks; Furman Elite-16 PF Ei
LP12, Lingo, Ekos, Arkiv-B in storage.

Always buy the very best you can afford, or the cheapest; anything else is a compromise, and compromises seldom satisfy.
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2012-05-05, 11:43
Post: #80
RE: Prices
(2012-05-05 09:15)Mark57 Wrote:  Linn's entire business model is based on selling 'premium' products at 'premium' prices.

Indeed; and of course, that's still true for Linn Products, where the only way to get a Linn Product is to buy it from Linn's supply chain.

But Linn Records (LR) has strayed into "retailer" territory, where the identical, non-branded, product, with a near-identical level of service, can be bought elsewhere. The risk here is of customers feeling overcharged for re-issues; as has been seen on this thread, many do not distinguish between the price for a re-issue that's available elsewhere, and a brand new release that LR has created, so this perception of artificial overcharging could spill over to new LR releases, to the detriment of the long-term viability of the business.

Remember IBM's experience with the PC? It became unable to compete because it felt "entitled" to higher prices as a "reward" for having defined the product and its market. LR has had similar success in its market, but really ought to wake up to the idea that its success means that others are nibbling its cheese.

NickP
KELRDSM, Klouts, Keltiks; Furman Elite-16 PF Ei
LP12, Lingo, Ekos, Arkiv-B in storage.

Always buy the very best you can afford, or the cheapest; anything else is a compromise, and compromises seldom satisfy.
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