tone arm cable upgrades

[Oddeoguy59]

I have an ittok lv11 on my lp12 and it has been suggested that I replace it with a cardas cable. I found the plug not to be as deep which leads me to beleive it nay not make sufficient contact in the arm, as well the cable was shorter and not as flexible so I thought it may reap havock with the suspention. However the salesman almost has me convinced that cables degrade over time and that technology has evolved so much that I am crazy not to change it.

Any input would be appriciated.

[eye-fi]

If your gonna change the tonearm cable on the Ittok then you also need to change the internal wiring & the cartridge leads to reap a sensible & worthwhile benefit.

I recently put a VDH silver hybrid cable on my Ekos to try out & I must say the sound is now held much more together with better defined highs. I also have some VDH MCS150 silver litz cartridge leads that I've used for many a year that I found made a astonishing improvement. The Ittok will equally benefit in the same way.

While your at it, if you decide to take up the challenge, get a new tt mat (not a Linn felt mat) to further improve what you can dig out of the groove.

[Mescalito]

Er, People, changing the cable gives better highs? Let's get a little reality here. Conductors are conductors. As long as there are no gross impurities ( and I do mean gross) in the conductors to introduce non-linear effects, they are not going to effect the sound one little bit.
However, if spending shed loads of bread on snake oil cables does it for you, who am I to gainsay you. Personally, I'd rather spend the cash on more music, or going to see some live stuff.

Chris

[flatpopely]

Or send your Ittok to AudioOrigami and hear what cables can do to the Ittok.

Mescalito Wrote:Er, People, changing the cable gives better highs? Let's get a little reality here. Conductors are conductors. As long as there are no gross impurities ( and I do mean gross) in the conductors to introduce non-linear effects, they are not going to effect the sound one little bit.
However, if spending shed loads of bread on snake oil cables does it for you, who am I to gainsay you. Personally, I'd rather spend the cash on more music, or going to see some live stuff.

Chris

[eye-fi]

Mescalito Wrote:Er, People, changing the cable gives better highs? Let's get a little reality here. Conductors are conductors.

As they are to everyone whom doesn't like to try. I'm more than happy for you to carry on using your leads.

If anything people should at the very least get a decent set of cartridge leads.

[Real1shepherd]

Sure, spend thousands on line conditioners, cardas cables, mega expensive phono tube preamps, arm modifications and the like. In the end, the only 'respect' you'll get is from other tweako-cultists who have done or who are contemplating doing the same thing. It's your money, after all. Some upgrades definitely work because they may improve corroded or faulty wiring, or a compromised/inferior cart, but it's folly to think components 'sense' the last few feet of current that comes into them. Especially when you consider what electricity has traveled through to get to your wall plug and then assume that magically, you can 'condition' and transform those last few feet.

As was wisely stated, conductors are conductors unless there's gross discrepancies between them. If I spent thousands on upgrades, I could also hear wonderful 'soundstage', 'silence', 'tightness' and all the other golden adjectives used in the 'feel good about my purchase' experience.;-). But take a hundred people with good ears (teenagers for example) and do a A/B/X listening experience. You're only kidding yourself that they will hear all your tweako-cultist upgrades. Yeah I know...they need to 'train' their ears for what they're not really hearing......lol

Kevin

eye-fi Wrote:

Mescalito Wrote:Er, People, changing the cable gives better highs? Let's get a little reality here. Conductors are conductors.

As they are to everyone whom doesn't like to try. I'm more than happy for you to carry on using your leads.

If anything people should at the very least get a decent set of cartridge leads.

[eye-fi]

Real1shepherd Wrote:Sure, spend thousands on line conditioners, cardas cables, mega expensive phono tube preamps, arm modifications and the like. In the end, the only 'respect' you'll get is from other tweako-cultists who have done or who are contemplating doing the same thing. It's your money, after all. Some upgrades definitely work because they may improve corroded or faulty wiring, or a compromised/inferior cart, but it's folly to think components 'sense' the last few feet of current that comes into them. Especially when you consider what electricity has traveled through to get to your wall plug and then assume that magically, you can 'condition' and transform those last few feet.

Firstly, I'm not talking about mains cables & the current produced from a cartridge is not derived from any connection whatsoever from the mains.

Secondly, I've "proved" it with one of my friends whom thought cable was a load of hoo haa. I lent him a set of cartridge leads & after a session with them he would not give them back. I sold them to him!!
He could hear so much MORE information & even all the little snap,crackle & pop from he's vinyl that was not present before.

Quote:But take a hundred people with good ears (teenagers for example) and do a A/B/X listening experience. You're only kidding yourself that they will hear all your tweako-cultist upgrades. Yeah I know...they need to 'train' their ears for what they're not really hearing......lol

It may come as a surprise to you that I was much younger when I did most of these experiments.

I'm not really bothered if someone else cannot hear a difference, there my ears. Most people are more than happy with thier Ipods & midi systems, if they can't hear what's wrong with them how the hell do you expect them to hear differences in hi-fi?
[/quote]

[vicdiaz]

Most of the time the 'enhancements' your hear is because contacts were cleaned by the removal and insertion of new plugs/cables.

[Real1shepherd]

I was also talking about conductors in your system, not just line conditioning-go back and reread. As was said below your last post, just unplugging and replugging in can improve the end product, as you've deleted some corrosion-not always visible even to the eye.

You might be able to sell your friends, but you can't sell me unless I hear the gain. If nobody else can hear ALL your improvements, then you're just in the 'feel-good-about-my-purchase' warm glow. Like I said it's your money. If you want to substantially $ improve your system, attack your speakers.

As far as young people and their Ipods etc...they're being mass consumerized like no other generation before them-the digi generation. Have to have the best cell phone, the best Ipod, the best laptop etc. Sometimes to the ruination of their credit-something to which their parents didn't tutor them sufficiently in. Rather, I take young individuals and let them hear old school hifi. I've even taken parts of my system and set up dances where we played techno and rock from just miserable mp3 files. They never heard anything like that before and considering the systems I've seen to scratch on and the like, no wonder. And there was some decent money spent on those systems as well. All bass attenuated with poor piano and voice reproduction. And I myself, have far from what I would consider true 'hi-fi'.

Kevin

eye-fi Wrote:

Real1shepherd Wrote:Sure, spend thousands on line conditioners, cardas cables, mega expensive phono tube preamps, arm modifications and the like. In the end, the only 'respect' you'll get is from other tweako-cultists who have done or who are contemplating doing the same thing. It's your money, after all. Some upgrades definitely work because they may improve corroded or faulty wiring, or a compromised/inferior cart, but it's folly to think components 'sense' the last few feet of current that comes into them. Especially when you consider what electricity has traveled through to get to your wall plug and then assume that magically, you can 'condition' and transform those last few feet.

Firstly, I'm not talking about mains cables & the current produced from a cartridge is not derived from any connection whatsoever from the mains.

Secondly, I've "proved" it with one of my friends whom thought cable was a load of hoo haa. I lent him a set of cartridge leads & after a session with them he would not give them back. I sold them to him!!
He could hear so much MORE information & even all the little snap,crackle & pop from he's vinyl that was not present before.

Quote:But take a hundred people with good ears (teenagers for example) and do a A/B/X listening experience. You're only kidding yourself that they will hear all your tweako-cultist upgrades. Yeah I know...they need to 'train' their ears for what they're not really hearing......lol

It may come as a surprise to you that I was much younger when I did most of these experiments.

I'm not really bothered if someone else cannot hear a difference, there my ears. Most people are more than happy with thier Ipods & midi systems, if they can't hear what's wrong with them how the hell do you expect them to hear differences in hi-fi?

[/quote]

[eye-fi]

Real1shepherd Wrote:I was also talking about conductors in your system, not just line conditioning-go back and reread.

Oh yea amoungst everything else you mentioned cardas cables.

Quote:As was said below your last post, just unplugging and replugging in can improve the end product, as you've deleted some corrosion-not always visible even to the eye.

True, very true but I've never heard such large differences from contanimation, not from well looked after hi-fi.

Quote:You might be able to sell your friends, but you can't sell me unless I hear the gain. If nobody else can hear ALLl your improvements, then you're just in the 'feel-good-about-my-purchase' warm glow. Like I said it's your money. If you want to substantially $ improve your system, attack your speakers.

Nope I don't expect to sell you, I would have some skeptiscm if I read or was told something. I wouldn't believe fully until I heard it in the flesh.

The record clamp is no different, it sounds very promising but I have to gamble to see if the results are what is claimed.