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Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
2016-09-23, 16:43
Post: #31
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-22 00:31)Silences Wrote:  I am very excited by that announce and through some pictures we can already say that a big change came also from the new DAC chipset, LINN has moved from the Wolfson WM8741 (32/192 Max - 128/-110) to the fresh new flagship AKM 4497EQ with more latitude (32/768kHz - 131(Mono)/-116 and more filters). There is also a difference in DSD but is it important ;-)

It seems that they have maintained the double DAc dual differential architecture too.
Maybe there is something to expect in the volume control too, New filters, upsampling, less change in word format with the Space optimisation?...not explained.

This is a point, among others ;-), which is not mentionned on Katalyst webpage.
Thanks for photos inside new Klimax!
Could you please show more pictures inside Klimax?

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2016-09-23, 17:03
Post: #32
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
Does sound of AK chip so better sound of WM chip? This is practically the only noticeable change in hardware of new Klimax from the photos. The output transformers and clock oscillator are the same.

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2016-09-23, 18:04
Post: #33
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-22 07:34)Sondek Wrote:  Further information including prices for Germany:
http://www.audisseus.de/2016/09/21/linn-...rgestellt/

and for Switzerland http://www.hmmusic.ch/news/linn-katalyst
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2016-09-24, 10:04 (This post was last modified: 2016-09-24 10:06 by fred.)
Post: #34
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-23 12:57)Silences Wrote:  
(2016-09-23 05:44)fred Wrote:  Does it support DSD ?

Please remind this :

LINN DSD thoughts

Nevertheless the DAC implemented (AKM AK4497EQ) can handle it up to 22.4MHz but I think that it is useless to LINN
And think about SPACE optimisation, volume control...

Yes, but I still believe that Linn could/will hopefully allow it. Thanks to your insights, one could hope that enabling DSD decoding would not compromise PCM decoding design.

Individual preferences set aside, I think it’s valuable and fun to be able to compare different masterings (as from a vinyl or a master tape, even though they will likely become extinct too !)

And yes, I admit I hear a different sonic signature that I enjoy with DSD masters - even through a « bottleneck » format and « flawed » D/A process (server side 24/176 PCM transcoding, thanks to minimserver)

This doesn't stop me from « worshiping » my KDSM/1 for what it does along with Linn technological achievements.

I can't wait to hear a KDSM/2 and I will praise for DSD compatibility and others features I’m wishing for (phono pre-amp in the A/D domain, multiple analog inputs box, SO measurement enhancements to address complex spaces, digital SO out, clocking in/out, and … high end design metal remote control)
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2016-09-24, 10:19 (This post was last modified: 2016-09-24 10:21 by DavidHB.)
Post: #35
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-24 10:04)fred Wrote:  Yes, but I still believe that Linn could/will hopefully allow it. Thanks to your insights, one could hope that enabling DSD decoding would not compromise PCM decoding design.

The essential point about DSD is not technical, it's that, for whatever reason, Linn have set their face against supporting it, as a matter of policy. Experience suggests that, when they make decisions of that kind, they stick to them though thick and thin; you won't see a USB port or wireless connectivity on any Linn product. There have been occasional changes of mind (they were originally opposed to digital technology, for instance - probably for good reason at the time), but in this case I wouldn't hold my breath.

David
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2016-09-24, 10:46
Post: #36
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-24 10:04)fred Wrote:  
(2016-09-23 12:57)Silences Wrote:  
(2016-09-23 05:44)fred Wrote:  Does it support DSD ?

Please remind this :

LINN DSD thoughts

Nevertheless the DAC implemented (AKM AK4497EQ) can handle it up to 22.4MHz but I think that it is useless to LINN
And think about SPACE optimisation, volume control...

Yes, but I still believe that Linn could/will hopefully allow it. Thanks to your insights, one could hope that enabling DSD decoding would not compromise PCM decoding design.

Individual preferences set aside, I think it’s valuable and fun to be able to compare different masterings (as from a vinyl or a master tape, even though they will likely become extinct too !)

And yes, I admit I hear a different sonic signature that I enjoy with DSD masters - even through a « bottleneck » format and « flawed » D/A process (server side 24/176 PCM transcoding, thanks to minimserver)

This doesn't stop me from « worshiping » my KDSM/1 for what it does along with Linn technological achievements.

I can't wait to hear a KDSM/2 and I will praise for DSD compatibility and others features I’m wishing for (phono pre-amp in the A/D domain, multiple analog inputs box, SO measurement enhancements to address complex spaces, digital SO out, clocking in/out, and … high end design metal remote control)
Don't worry to much about DSD. As Linn is still proving with each generation of their hardware is that it is not the format that matters most, but the way you process it.
My ADS/0 wasn't as good with 24/192 as my current ADSM is with playing 16/44.1
I think that you'll find that the new KDS will be better at playing 16/44.1 than my ADSM is with 24/192.
As the fast majority of music in the world is in 16/44.1, and seeing that history has proven that hi-res formats will never be popular, I prefer Linn to focus on getting the most out of 16/44.1 up instead of trying to decode another obsolete format, which, just like 180gm vinyl and SACD before, DSD is. Low bit Spotify is a lot more popular than Qobuz will ever be.

I'm including 180gm vinyl as a couple of weeks ago I got to listen to an original 'Satisfaction' version of the Stones. Supposedly it was a real best seller in its day. All I know it was probably the lousiest record I've ever heard.
Back then people enjoyed terrible playback as much as nowadays.
I'm not happy about it either, but it is how it is.
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2016-09-24, 10:46
Post: #37
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-24 10:19)DavidHB Wrote:  
(2016-09-24 10:04)fred Wrote:  Yes, but I still believe that Linn could/will hopefully allow it. Thanks to your insights, one could hope that enabling DSD decoding would not compromise PCM decoding design.

The essential point about DSD is not technical, it's that, for whatever reason, Linn have set their face against supporting it, as a matter of policy. Experience suggests that, when they make decisions of that kind, they stick to them though thick and thin; you won't see a USB port or wireless connectivity on any Linn product. There have been occasional changes of mind (they were originally opposed to digital technology, for instance - probably for good reason at the time), but in this case I wouldn't hold my breath.

David

Thanks for your reply, hope they will eventually reconsider.
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2016-09-25, 05:04
Post: #38
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-24 10:46)fred Wrote:  
(2016-09-24 10:19)DavidHB Wrote:  
(2016-09-24 10:04)fred Wrote:  Yes, but I still believe that Linn could/will hopefully allow it. Thanks to your insights, one could hope that enabling DSD decoding would not compromise PCM decoding design.

The essential point about DSD is not technical, it's that, for whatever reason, Linn have set their face against supporting it, as a matter of policy. Experience suggests that, when they make decisions of that kind, they stick to them though thick and thin; you won't see a USB port or wireless connectivity on any Linn product. There have been occasional changes of mind (they were originally opposed to digital technology, for instance - probably for good reason at the time), but in this case I wouldn't hold my breath.

David

Thanks for your reply, hope they will eventually reconsider.
I wouldn't totally bet against Linn ever supporting DSD. If it becomes popular enough they will support it.

As to Linn sticking to their guns, in the first days of the KDS Ivor told me they would never support Apple formats and that Apple's closed system would fail and put them out of business. I told him that within a year Apple would be the largest seller of music in the world and Linn couldn't ignore that. Linn supported AIFF about six months after the conversation and the other Apple formats in less than two years. If you search hard enough you might also find the article where Gilad bashes AirPlay and says Linn will not support it. NetAux anyone??

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2016-09-25, 07:36
Post: #39
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
(2016-09-25 05:04)ThomasOK Wrote:  I wouldn't totally bet against Linn ever supporting DSD. If it becomes popular enough they will support it.
As to Linn sticking to their guns, in the first days of the KDS Ivor told me they would never support Apple formats and that Apple's closed system would fail and put them out of business. I told him that within a year Apple would be the largest seller of music in the world and Linn couldn't ignore that. Linn supported AIFF about six months after the conversation and the other Apple formats in less than two years. If you search hard enough you might also find the article where Gilad bashes AirPlay and says Linn will not support it. NetAux anyone??

DSD would be a win-win situation for both the customer and the company.
Imagine DSD256 or DSD512 through a well set-up Linn system.:-)
And the new AKM chip can handle it.

Matt

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2016-09-25, 09:42
Post: #40
RE: Introducing the new Klimax DS and Klimax DSM with Katalyst DAC Architecture
Wow, finally a worthy upgrade for Klimax DSM with HDMI 2.0!!

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