Linn Forums

Current time: 2017-10-17, 00:40 Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Linn Forums / Linn Music Systems & Hi-fi Separates / Network Music Players & Music Streamers / Exakt v / Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers

Post Reply 
Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
2017-07-17, 06:36
Post: #11
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-16 18:23)sunbeamgls Wrote:  
(2017-07-16 16:20)timster Wrote:  I think the LinnDocs is saying your 5th option isn't possible. I think it is also saying you can connect one sub to the left and one to the right, using just the one sub-box. That would be the way I'd go anyway, but then I use my sub for stereo listening so the LFE option wouldn't work.

You could be right Timster, but why does the documentation say there are 2 DACs in an Exaktbox sub? If it can't run independent signals to each sub, why would it have 2 DACs?

One for each channel in stereo mode?

It does say a system cannot be configured to have both LFE and other, according to Mr.Bear's quote ("Sub channel configurations are mutually exclusive. Only one type of sub configuration may be present on any system (a sub configuration counts as a front left/right pair, Mono, or LFE)."

That was his 5th option I think.

Akurate EDSM | Majik ExaktBox-I [on Custom Design iRAPs] | Majik 140, REL T5
Rega RP1, [DS214play +Jitterbug, MinimServer], Kazoo [Linx1010]

AV: Marantz NR1506 | B&W 652(C), M1(S), REL T5 (LFE) | Fronts powered by Linn
Net: NetGear DGN2200 | GS108 | AQ Forest x3

Hello to Jason Isaacs
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-17, 10:21 (This post was last modified: 2017-07-17 10:22 by sunbeamgls.)
Post: #12
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-17 06:36)timster Wrote:  
(2017-07-16 18:23)sunbeamgls Wrote:  
(2017-07-16 16:20)timster Wrote:  I think the LinnDocs is saying your 5th option isn't possible. I think it is also saying you can connect one sub to the left and one to the right, using just the one sub-box. That would be the way I'd go anyway, but then I use my sub for stereo listening so the LFE option wouldn't work.

You could be right Timster, but why does the documentation say there are 2 DACs in an Exaktbox sub? If it can't run independent signals to each sub, why would it have 2 DACs?

One for each channel in stereo mode?

It does say a system cannot be configured to have both LFE and other, according to Mr.Bear's quote ("Sub channel configurations are mutually exclusive. Only one type of sub configuration may be present on any system (a sub configuration counts as a front left/right pair, Mono, or LFE)."

That was his 5th option I think.

So is the solution to connect 2x subs in stereo and then get the source to mix the LFE into the stereo L&R? Is that possible in the Oppo, or Konfig?

Main: AK/0/D; AEDSM; MeiCord AExaktbox10; Silvers 2x A4200/1; K400 NSL Exakt dual-mono PMC Twenty.26; Twenty.C; Blacks AV5125 PMC Twenty.21
Playroom: SBT; V-DAC1; Cyrus6; M773e
Garage: SBT/Rega DAC; Arcam AVR100; 2x AV5125; Aktiv Ninkas, Trikan, AVSeKretan
www.audiophilemusings.co.uk
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-17, 10:27
Post: #13
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
Possibly in the Oppo? I know my AV processor allows for not having a sub, and I presume in that case it will mix the LFE channel (or the .x for 7.2 etc) into the stereo front pair. But that's a pure guess. Paul would know - he doesn't have a sub.

Akurate EDSM | Majik ExaktBox-I [on Custom Design iRAPs] | Majik 140, REL T5
Rega RP1, [DS214play +Jitterbug, MinimServer], Kazoo [Linx1010]

AV: Marantz NR1506 | B&W 652(C), M1(S), REL T5 (LFE) | Fronts powered by Linn
Net: NetGear DGN2200 | GS108 | AQ Forest x3

Hello to Jason Isaacs
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-17, 15:14
Post: #14
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-17 10:27)timster Wrote:  Possibly in the Oppo? I know my AV processor allows for not having a sub, and I presume in that case it will mix the LFE channel (or the .x for 7.2 etc) into the stereo front pair. But that's a pure guess. Paul would know - he doesn't have a sub.

In the setup menu of my OPPO 105, I can tell the OPPO I don't have a sub. In my case, that is what I have done.

I presume it down mixes the LFE to the other speakers.

However, because all the data goes through an HDMI cable, from the OPPO to the AEDSM, it may not make any difference if I tell the OPPO I have a sub, to send all the information to the AEDSM?

Konfig would know I don't have a sub, so it may do the down mix if I tell the OPPO I have a sub.

I should try to do a listening test, with the sub turned on and off on the OPPO setup.

I am certainly not missing any bass.

Exakt Surround 5.0:
AEDSM, Exakt Akubariks, Akurate Exaktbox 6/4200 for 225 Centre, Majik Exaktbox I for 212 Surrds, OPPO 105 on StillPoints.
Power: Environmental Potentials 2460, Shunyata Triton, Zitron Cobras, Alpha Digitals
Room Acoustics: SPACE, SubDude HT's, Acoustic Panels
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-17, 21:44 (This post was last modified: 2017-07-17 21:45 by drac.)
Post: #15
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
The problem with putting LFE feed into L & R is the lack of head room for the LFE feed. The .1 in 5.1 is a decimal place because it is 10dB smaller signal for the same volume, hence it's an order of magnitude smaller signal. It was designed like this to give it the head room for large scale effects. When it is times by 10 to incorporate it into the stereo signal it loses that headroom. on top of this, frequently equipment attenuates the signal by 5dB further to prevent clipping from the mixed additive signals.

The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects.

I have an active 5.1 system and have not gone exakt yet, although I would like to, because all of the details have not quite been sorted.

Lounge - ADSM, AV5125/d, Aktiv Katan
Dinning/Kitchen - 2x5125/d, Aktiv Ninka,
Movie room - Oppo 105, ADSM, 3x5125/d, Aktiv AV5140, AV5120 & Keilidh - Paradigm Sub 25 - ISF calibrated 60" Pioneer Kuro.
Bedroom - MDSM, Aktiv 109.
Garage - MDSI, katan
Deck - Renew ADS, 5125, Def tech AW6500.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-17, 22:00
Post: #16
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-17 21:44)drac Wrote:  The problem with putting LFE feed into L & R is the lack of head room for the LFE feed. The .1 in 5.1 is a decimal place because it is 10dB smaller signal for the same volume, hence it's an order of magnitude smaller signal. It was designed like this to give it the head room for large scale effects. When it is times by 10 to incorporate it into the stereo signal it loses that headroom. on top of this, frequently equipment attenuates the signal by 5dB further to prevent clipping from the mixed additive signals.

The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects.

I have an active 5.1 system and have not gone exakt yet, although I would like to, because all of the details have not quite been sorted.

I am no engineer, so most of what you said is over my head, however your second to last paragraph IS what I was thinking would be THE way to go; assuming Exakt/Oppo can can do this - Thank you.

"...The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects..."

***See profile bio for complete system description***
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-18, 06:12
Post: #17
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-17 22:00)Mr.Bear Wrote:  
(2017-07-17 21:44)drac Wrote:  The problem with putting LFE feed into L & R is the lack of head room for the LFE feed. The .1 in 5.1 is a decimal place because it is 10dB smaller signal for the same volume, hence it's an order of magnitude smaller signal. It was designed like this to give it the head room for large scale effects. When it is times by 10 to incorporate it into the stereo signal it loses that headroom. on top of this, frequently equipment attenuates the signal by 5dB further to prevent clipping from the mixed additive signals.

The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects.

I have an active 5.1 system and have not gone exakt yet, although I would like to, because all of the details have not quite been sorted.

I am no engineer, so most of what you said is over my head, however your second to last paragraph IS what I was thinking would be THE way to go; assuming Exakt/Oppo can can do this - Thank you.

"...The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects..."

However, the quote you posted from LinnDocs (where was that by the way?) said that in any system, the sub configurations are mutually exclusive. So you can't have both stereo and LFE, regardless of number of Exaktbox subs.
I think that needs clarifying from Linn Wink

Akurate EDSM | Majik ExaktBox-I [on Custom Design iRAPs] | Majik 140, REL T5
Rega RP1, [DS214play +Jitterbug, MinimServer], Kazoo [Linx1010]

AV: Marantz NR1506 | B&W 652(C), M1(S), REL T5 (LFE) | Fronts powered by Linn
Net: NetGear DGN2200 | GS108 | AQ Forest x3

Hello to Jason Isaacs
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-18, 13:51
Post: #18
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-18 06:12)timster Wrote:  
(2017-07-17 22:00)Mr.Bear Wrote:  
(2017-07-17 21:44)drac Wrote:  The problem with putting LFE feed into L & R is the lack of head room for the LFE feed. The .1 in 5.1 is a decimal place because it is 10dB smaller signal for the same volume, hence it's an order of magnitude smaller signal. It was designed like this to give it the head room for large scale effects. When it is times by 10 to incorporate it into the stereo signal it loses that headroom. on top of this, frequently equipment attenuates the signal by 5dB further to prevent clipping from the mixed additive signals.

The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects.

I have an active 5.1 system and have not gone exakt yet, although I would like to, because all of the details have not quite been sorted.

I am no engineer, so most of what you said is over my head, however your second to last paragraph IS what I was thinking would be THE way to go; assuming Exakt/Oppo can can do this - Thank you.

"...The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects..."

However, the quote you posted from LinnDocs (where was that by the way?) said that in any system, the sub configurations are mutually exclusive. So you can't have both stereo and LFE, regardless of number of Exaktbox subs.
I think that needs clarifying from Linn Wink

Hi Timster - here are two link from which I copied/pasted the info from:

https://www.linn.co.uk/hifi-separates/up...aktbox-sub

http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/ExaktSurround

***See profile bio for complete system description***
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
2017-07-18, 14:13 (This post was last modified: 2017-07-18 14:14 by timster.)
Post: #19
RE: Best way to use TWO Exakt Subwoofers
(2017-07-18 13:51)Mr.Bear Wrote:  
(2017-07-18 06:12)timster Wrote:  
(2017-07-17 22:00)Mr.Bear Wrote:  
(2017-07-17 21:44)drac Wrote:  The problem with putting LFE feed into L & R is the lack of head room for the LFE feed. The .1 in 5.1 is a decimal place because it is 10dB smaller signal for the same volume, hence it's an order of magnitude smaller signal. It was designed like this to give it the head room for large scale effects. When it is times by 10 to incorporate it into the stereo signal it loses that headroom. on top of this, frequently equipment attenuates the signal by 5dB further to prevent clipping from the mixed additive signals.

The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects.

I have an active 5.1 system and have not gone exakt yet, although I would like to, because all of the details have not quite been sorted.

I am no engineer, so most of what you said is over my head, however your second to last paragraph IS what I was thinking would be THE way to go; assuming Exakt/Oppo can can do this - Thank you.

"...The best solution I can think of for this kind of mixed music/movie setup would be to have 2 exact sub boxes. Each one feeding a sub but with 2 outs 1 doing stereo L or R and the other the LFE component. Good for music but with the headroom for effects..."

However, the quote you posted from LinnDocs (where was that by the way?) said that in any system, the sub configurations are mutually exclusive. So you can't have both stereo and LFE, regardless of number of Exaktbox subs.
I think that needs clarifying from Linn Wink

Hi Timster - here are two link from which I copied/pasted the info from:

https://www.linn.co.uk/hifi-separates/up...aktbox-sub

http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/ExaktSurround

Ahh. Thanks. Interesting. If a bit confusing.
I think, under Subs, where it says "Selecting front left (or right) instructs the sub to play the same content as the front left (or right) speaker. You should only select this if you have 2 subs, one assigned to each left and right." is the way to go with 2 subs. And the image at the top shows one Exaktbox sub connected to 2 subs. If you have 2 subs connected with 2 Exaktboxes in Mono mode, or LFE, how does it know which to send to Left or Right? They will both play the same mixed together, which I suppose is no bad thing in itself, but an extra box to do less...

But this is a bit odd to me: I don't understand why "When using a front left/right sub pair, a mono sub, or no sub, any LFE content will be directed to front left and right speakers" and not to the sub(s) that there are. Seems counter-intuitive.

Akurate EDSM | Majik ExaktBox-I [on Custom Design iRAPs] | Majik 140, REL T5
Rega RP1, [DS214play +Jitterbug, MinimServer], Kazoo [Linx1010]

AV: Marantz NR1506 | B&W 652(C), M1(S), REL T5 (LFE) | Fronts powered by Linn
Net: NetGear DGN2200 | GS108 | AQ Forest x3

Hello to Jason Isaacs
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)