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LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
2017-08-17, 15:53
Post: #21
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-17 00:03)Dazza Wrote:  Fortunately I am based in Leicester and Cymbiosis is only about 10 miles from where I live, so when I have enough funds that's where I will be going. In the meantime I shall continue enjoying my current system and reading more of your posts on the forum, keep up the good work guys.

You are indeed a lucky fellow. Peter will help you sort this out by letting you hear for yourself.

Just listen .... or not
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2017-08-17, 20:36
Post: #22
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
An alternative view ...

What about synergy?

I have an Akudorik Exact set up (Akurate level) and an Akurate level LP12. It all fits together like a glove. It's sublime and musical and is my end game UNLESS I decide to go ALL Klimax.

Is it wrong that I am happy taking this approach e.g. prioritaising system synergy v a more 'bitty' upgrade path?

Stu.

Akurate Sondek LP12 - Akurate EDSM - Akudorik Exakt
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2017-08-18, 07:32
Post: #23
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
Synergy in a system is great where it means that all the components are of a quality and character that will do each other justice.

Sometimes however , a perceived "synergy" can result from parts of the system masking errors in other parts.

That said, and regardless of the pedantics ...

The main thing with any sensible upgrade path is that you should be able to stop and get off at any point with the system remaining "right".

Get it wrong and you'll never be happy with the system. Its always " ...going to be OK once I've got a better arm" or " ...when I've changed the speakers".

Whilst there are often viable options , the one fool proof option is always to upgrade from the source.

You can't have too good a signal to amplify !
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2017-08-18, 09:07
Post: #24
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-18 07:32)smokestack Wrote:  Synergy in a system is great where it means that all the components are of a quality and character that will do each other justice.

Sometimes however , a perceived "synergy" can result from parts of the system masking errors in other parts.

That said, and regardless of the pedantics ...

The main thing with any sensible upgrade path is that you should be able to stop and get off at any point with the system remaining "right".

Get it wrong and you'll never be happy with the system. Its always " ...going to be OK once I've got a better arm" or " ...when I've changed the speakers".

Whilst there are often viable options , the one fool proof option is always to upgrade from the source.

You can't have too good a signal to amplify !

Guess the point I am making is that not many people stop at Radikal meaning that unless you are prepared to go all in, you will always be tempted to want more .... and as you describe above, never settle.

Finding your level and being happy isn't a bad thing.

Stu.

Akurate Sondek LP12 - Akurate EDSM - Akudorik Exakt
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2017-08-18, 16:37
Post: #25
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-17 11:59)smokestack Wrote:  Musically, the AT95 still outperforms most cartridges .

Yes , there are plenty of better cartridges [all much more expensive] but there are a damn site more inferior ones...regardless of price.

Could be. I haven't had the pleasure of an audition.

But if the AT95 is like other LOMC cartridges, its sound is going to be impacted by its loading. Maybe the AT95 is especially well matched to the Linto.

The term "more musical" is often used to describe so many cartridges.

In my experience, most LOMC cartridges are significantly affected by their loading.

I am always curious about the loading when I hear assertions about LOMC cartridges.

When I got my Krystal, I tried it at 100 ohms and thought it to be a bit dull. I liked it at 250 ohms, so I played it there. It was changing character during the run in, and so I dropped it back to 100 ohms and liked it better.

I mentioned this to Peter Swain and he suggested that, if I could try 50, I might like it better still. I have a 47 ohm setting, so I tried it, and was (and remain) delighted. It turns out the Linn's official load spec for the Krystal is 53 ohms, and for the Kandid is 42.

Cartridge loading changes have been noticeable on all of the arms and TTs here, from Denons to Ortofons, from Dynavectors to Linns, from LP12s to Thorens TD147s to Duals, Garrards, ad nauseam.

So when someone tells me about how an LOMC compares to another MC or MM cartridge, it's just "interesting." Nothing to get hung about.

In most of the US, it is nearly impossible to audition a cartridge before buying it. But an audition is really desirable, and even then, the circumstances of the audition may make the result irrelevant in your home system.

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2017-08-18, 19:11 (This post was last modified: 2017-08-18 19:17 by Glyn Ruck.)
Post: #26
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-18 16:37)Peer Gynt Wrote:  
(2017-08-17 11:59)smokestack Wrote:  Musically, the AT95 still outperforms most cartridges .

Yes , there are plenty of better cartridges [all much more expensive] but there are a damn site more inferior ones...regardless of price.

Could be. I haven't had the pleasure of an audition.

But if the AT95 is like other LOMC cartridges, its sound is going to be impacted by its loading. Maybe the AT95 is especially well matched to the Linto.

The term "more musical" is often used to describe so many cartridges.

In my experience, most LOMC cartridges are significantly affected by their loading.

I am always curious about the loading when I hear assertions about LOMC cartridges.

When I got my Krystal, I tried it at 100 ohms and thought it to be a bit dull. I liked it at 250 ohms, so I played it there. It was changing character during the run in, and so I dropped it back to 100 ohms and liked it better.

I mentioned this to Peter Swain and he suggested that, if I could try 50, I might like it better still. I have a 47 ohm setting, so I tried it, and was (and remain) delighted. It turns out the Linn's official load spec for the Krystal is 53 ohms, and for the Kandid is 42.

Cartridge loading changes have been noticeable on all of the arms and TTs here, from Denons to Ortofons, from Dynavectors to Linns, from LP12s to Thorens TD147s to Duals, Garrards, ad nauseam.

So when someone tells me about how an LOMC compares to another MC or MM cartridge, it's just "interesting." Nothing to get hung about.

In most of the US, it is nearly impossible to audition a cartridge before buying it. But an audition is really desirable, and even then, the circumstances of the audition may make the result irrelevant in your home system.



The AT95e is a High Output MM cartridge that likes to look into 47k. Ideal for people on a very tight budget. Output 3.5mv

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2017-08-21, 18:47 (This post was last modified: 2017-08-21 18:50 by Cymbiosis.)
Post: #27
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-18 16:37)Peer Gynt Wrote:  The term "more musical" is often used to describe so many cartridges.

In my experience, most LOMC cartridges are significantly affected by their loading.

I am always curious about the loading when I hear assertions about LOMC cartridges.

When I got my Krystal, I tried it at 100 ohms and thought it to be a bit dull. I liked it at 250 ohms, so I played it there. It was changing character during the run in, and so I dropped it back to 100 ohms and liked it better.

I mentioned this to Peter Swain and he suggested that, if I could try 50, I might like it better still. I have a 47 ohm setting, so I tried it, and was (and remain) delighted. It turns out the Linn's official load spec for the Krystal is 53 ohms, and for the Kandid is 42.

In most of the US, it is nearly impossible to audition a cartridge before buying it. But an audition is really desirable, and even then, the circumstances of the audition may make the result irrelevant in your home system.

Happy to help when I can, no matter where you are. It's often just an email with some suggestions but .......... If you end up with a better sound - Great!

KR

Peter

(2017-08-18 19:11)Glyn Ruck Wrote:  The AT95e is a High Output MM cartridge

For about GBP40.00 in the UK it is fantastic value and expect to pay at least double to improve upon it IMHO.

Fettling LP12s since 1980
Tel 0333 200 4475
Email - peter@cymbiosis.com
Skype - peteratcymbiosis
Facebook - www.facebook.com/Cymbiosisaudio/
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2017-08-21, 19:00
Post: #28
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-21 18:47)Cymbiosis Wrote:  
(2017-08-18 19:11)Glyn Ruck Wrote:  The AT95e is a High Output MM cartridge

For about GBP40.00 in the UK it is fantastic value and expect to pay at least double to improve upon it IMHO.

Yep! ~ Cheap as chips in SA & sold online for free delivery to your home. I have recommended to a number of people that want to rediscover their vinyl on a budget. Punches way above it's weight.
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2017-08-22, 13:24
Post: #29
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
I have Majik LP12 with Radikal, Trampoline and t-Kable, it sounds beautiful with standard Adikt and original project arm.
I was planning the usual upgrades shortly after (kore, arm, mc cartridge)but 3 years later haven't once felt it needed to go any further.
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2017-08-22, 16:09
Post: #30
RE: LP12 Majik/Radikal vs LP12 akurate
(2017-08-22 13:24)JoeLinn1964 Wrote:  I have Majik LP12 with Radikal, Trampoline and t-Kable, it sounds beautiful with standard Adikt and original project arm.
I was planning the usual upgrades shortly after (kore, arm, mc cartridge)but 3 years later haven't once felt it needed to go any further.

This is probably the reason I am thinking about getting a Radikal of the bat so I have a solid foundation and hopefully, like 'JoeLinn' have no immediate desire to upgrade. My original LP12 was obviously pre-cirkus with vahalla, Ittok, asak, so I would imagine any modern LP12 would be an improvement to my ears and a Radikal powered one mind blowing. I feel I will be more tempted to live with a Majik/radikal for longer than I would an Akurate LP12.

Plus there comes a point when your LP12 is so high spec that without suitable upgrades down stream, ie amp/speakers I would not hear the true potential. We all have our own end goal usually limited by budget, well certainly in my case anyway and for me I struggle to justify beyond £10K for my whole system. So as I said in my OP £6K-£7K for LP12 and the rest down stream, hopefully second hand so I get the best performance for my budget.

My problem is having to start from scratch which is a big financial outlay, where as if I'd kept my old LP12 and upgraded over the last 20yrs the pain to my wallet would have been numerous smaller bite size purchases, rather than one big hit. Still its nice to read about everyone opinions and own personal journeys.

I shall post when I finally get an LP12
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