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Keyboard control with Mac?
2016-08-26, 09:47
Post: #1
Keyboard control with Mac?
Has anyone developed a way of controlling DS volume from a Mac keyboard?

I run Kinsky in my office and when someone comes in, it is a pain to find the window, click on the stupid volume control wheel, rotate it with the mouse. I'd like to have a set of keys for up/down/mute and maybe even pause.

Thanks for any suggestions.
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2016-08-26, 20:52
Post: #2
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
Agreed, since pretty much all Macs have vol+, vol- and mute buttons I find this highly irritating.

The same should apply to iOS devices, vol+/- should be controllable by the physical buttons. The play/pause next/previous buttons should also behave during screenlock like they do in other apps eg Tidal.
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2016-08-26, 21:51
Post: #3
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-26 09:47)AnonyMouse Wrote:  Has anyone developed a way of controlling DS volume from a Mac keyboard?

I run Kinsky in my office and when someone comes in, it is a pain to find the window, click on the stupid volume control wheel, rotate it with the mouse. I'd like to have a set of keys for up/down/mute and maybe even pause.

Thanks for any suggestions.

You can just click on the volume control to mute your system, rather than having to rotate the wheel to turn the volume down.

David
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2016-08-27, 08:13
Post: #4
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-26 21:51)davidd Wrote:  
(2016-08-26 09:47)AnonyMouse Wrote:  Has anyone developed a way of controlling DS volume from a Mac keyboard?

I run Kinsky in my office and when someone comes in, it is a pain to find the window, click on the stupid volume control wheel, rotate it with the mouse. I'd like to have a set of keys for up/down/mute and maybe even pause.

Thanks for any suggestions.

You can just click on the volume control to mute your system, rather than having to rotate the wheel to turn the volume down.

David

He still has to find the window Wink I have noticed that Kinsky on my Win10 tablet transmits the volume control through to the DSM though, as it did on my iPod (but not on my Win7 laptop - any ideas why?). Perhaps the Kazoo infrastructure is different?

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2016-08-27, 11:13
Post: #5
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-26 21:51)davidd Wrote:  
(2016-08-26 09:47)AnonyMouse Wrote:  Has anyone developed a way of controlling DS volume from a Mac keyboard?

I run Kinsky in my office and when someone comes in, it is a pain to find the window, click on the stupid volume control wheel, rotate it with the mouse. I'd like to have a set of keys for up/down/mute and maybe even pause.

Thanks for any suggestions.
You can just click on the volume control to mute your system, rather than having to rotate the wheel to turn the volume down.

David
The OP requested that the program respond to hardware keys that are present on a keyboard. It is not a terribly onerous thing to implement. Directing to a software mute switch doesn't resolve the particular issue.

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2016-08-28, 18:55
Post: #6
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-27 11:13)linnrd Wrote:  The OP requested that the program respond to hardware keys that are present on a keyboard. It is not a terribly onerous thing to implement.

True, but it creates a usability issue of its own. On windowed, true multi-tasking OSs. Clearly, the control point should not take over all use of the hardware keys, as the user might want them to control the desktop's own audio (killing loud pop-up videos on web pages, for example). So the control point should only respond to the control point when it has focus - and that may require switching windows.

It would be nice if Kazoo had some equivalent of Kinsky's Kompact mode, that could be parked out of the way in a corner of the desktop, and quickly accessed when needed.

David
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2016-08-28, 20:00
Post: #7
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-28 18:55)DavidHB Wrote:  
(2016-08-27 11:13)linnrd Wrote:  The OP requested that the program respond to hardware keys that are present on a keyboard. It is not a terribly onerous thing to implement.

True, but it creates a usability issue of its own. On windowed, true multi-tasking OSs. Clearly, the control point should not take over all use of the hardware keys, as the user might want them to control the desktop's own audio (killing loud pop-up videos on web pages, for example). So the control point should only respond to the control point when it has focus - and that may require switching windows.

It would be nice if Kazoo had some equivalent of Kinsky's Kompact mode, that could be parked out of the way in a corner of the desktop, and quickly accessed when needed.

David
Ah...you misunderstand my intent. I am from a bygone era and rarely move my hands off the keyboard...relying on short-cuts/hot-keys in all my OSs. My preferred way would be to, say on a Win machine, <Alt>-Tab to the appropriate window and punch the mute key on the keyboard. On OS X, that would mean the <Command>-Tab for window switching. It is still preferable to map hard keys, even if it means assigning -, +, and . (as an example) to vol up, down and mute.

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2016-08-28, 20:10
Post: #8
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-28 18:55)DavidHB Wrote:  [...] it creates a usability issue of its own. On windowed, true multi-tasking OSs. Clearly, the control point should not take over all use of the hardware keys, as the user might want them to control the desktop's own audio (killing loud pop-up videos on web pages, for example). So the control point should only respond to the control point when it has focus

I understand your point in general, but in the case of volume control I think there is a strong usability case. We should be able to control major things in the physical environment without finding the control point window first. For example we can open the DVD drive door with a button on the keyboard, regardless of what application we are currently running.

From a UI perspective (and I don't understand the OS architecture so I don't know whether this is feasible in the kernel) I'd like either the current media controls (F7-F12) to be picked up by Kinsky; or I'd like to press (say) FN and these same buttons to instruct Kinsky and just the native button to instruct the Mac's system.

I'm fairly sure I've seen this kind of keyboard automation before on Mac; but it does require the app (Kinsky in this case) to have a simple set of keyboard shortcuts eg + for volume up, to which the keyboard can be remapped.
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2016-08-28, 20:22
Post: #9
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
Actually even enabling some simple keyboard shortcuts in the Kinsky app would be a help. SPACE, for example, could pause/unpause. That's pretty quick to get to when we find the window.
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2016-08-28, 21:55
Post: #10
RE: Keyboard control with Mac?
(2016-08-28 20:22)AnonyMouse Wrote:  Actually even enabling some simple keyboard shortcuts in the Kinsky app would be a help. SPACE, for example, could pause/unpause. That's pretty quick to get to when we find the window.

No argument with that but ...

The problem, if it is one, is not about when the user wants the mapped keys to work with the control point (I agree with all you and linnrd say on that); it's about when you want those keys to revert to their default function of controlling media playback from the computer itself.

Kazoo for Android, along with Bubble DS and I think some other control points (I don't know whether this is true with iOS), gives you the facility to use the volume control buttons on the tablet or phone with the Control Point, but only when it has focus; at other times the buttons revert to their normal function. Bubble DS adds to this by allowing you to put a control tile on the desktop of the device; this gives the normal set of transport buttons and volume control. These are useful functions.

When we translate that to a windowed OS (PC, Mac, Linux), the issue, as AnonyMouse pointed out in the original post, is that a number of windows may be open at once. Some of those windows (browsers being a prime example) may require the keys to behave in one way, and some in another. The only way of sorting this out that I know of is to give the control to the window that has focus, and this is indeed what is done (though with apps rather than windows) in the Android case.

The problem, in AnonyMouse's use case, is that at the moment you want the keys to work with the Control Point, it may not have the focus. I think that linnrd's methodology would work exactly as he describes (and probably provide the fastest response if there is no touch screen) if the media keys were enabled in Kazoo for desktops in the way I have outlined.

In a slightly lumbering way, I am saying that we all agree on the essentials. I am not sure that there is much hope of changing Kinsky (though that would be nice), but it is surely reasonable to ask that what has already been done in Kazoo for Android (and iOS?) should also be done, mutatis mutandis, in the new beta Kazoo for Windows.

David
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