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Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
2017-10-27, 07:54
Post: #11
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
I would be curious to hear from Linn how much input in to Melco design came from Linn. I have never heard or read that Linn recommends an audiophile NAS. Not sure how a device qualifies as audiophile, which I regard as a marketting term. Sales folk often used to rewrite my documents putting in adjectives like “world class”, but not one them was able to define this term.

I had a Melco demo and my conclusion is I’m more than happy to stay with my current setup with J River MC. I’d be surprised if you heard any improvement from Melco over QNAP or Raspberry Pi, but different ears & different system may behave differently. Perhaps, because I was so unimpressed with Melco representative who seemed to think he could bamboozle me with technical details, I’m not unbiased. I have an uncooperative aversion to being told something is better when I can listen & decide for myself. So I certainly won’t be buying one, but there are lots of things I wouldn’t buy that others might buy & enjoy.

Anyways my ability to hear differences may be impaired as I can’t hear a difference between a computer grade (i.e. fully meets specification) Ethernet cable and an audiophile one. However, I can easily hear differences between loudspeakers, amplifiers, DACs and record players. No idea why this is.

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2017-10-27, 08:31
Post: #12
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
Other than the Linn angle (which is interesting), the rest of this discussion about off the shelf parts, configuration of those and the software involved etc. etc. has been well rehearsed - it doesn't seem worth going around that loop again because it will be just a lot of argument with no conclusion.

What I would say, however, is that most of us here are "source first" advocates. And the NAS (or other forms of NAS type devices) are the primary source for us streaming types. So think about that, then have a listen, then assess the value of any (if any) changes you hear. There's no doubt that some hear changes but the value of those changes are an individual choice.

With a "source first" approach, its unwise to dismiss something on the basis of the bits its made from. Otherwise we'd all be listening to Sonos because all you need to stream is a bunch of industry standard bits assembled in the right order.

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2017-10-27, 08:38 (This post was last modified: 2017-10-27 08:39 by Tin.)
Post: #13
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
(2017-10-27 07:54)Wat Wrote:  I have never heard or read that Linn recommends an audiophile NAS. Not sure how a device qualifies as audiophile, which I regard as a marketting term.
They don't, and it is.

I can imagine that under certain circumstances there can be an advantage with a Melco:
First, the owersupply may be less crappy than that of a NAS, so if you have serious power issues in your home, that may help a bit. Of course replacing the power supply of the normal NAS or rearranging the devices should do the same trick and cheaper.

Another reason may be that one bought an expensive shielded ethernet cable where the shielding touches both the NAS, or switch, as the DS. This will introduce a lot of noise
The easiest remedy is replacing the expensive cable by a cheap ethernet patch cable, just as Linn advises, but for some folks that is never an acceptable solution.

I'm not saying that no one should buy a Melco, if you have a full Klimax set the price won't be much of a worry, they look nice and they may solve a problem, or at least ease some minds that they did the best they could. Psychology is a part of this game whether we like it or not. My setup improves with the Armagnac I pour into myself. It shouldn't, but it does.

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2017-10-27, 09:56
Post: #14
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
To counter the anti Melco sentiment, my experience of the Melco’s is that the base model produces a modest improvement over a standard “IT” NAS. It’s slightly more musical, with cleaner highs and mids but the lower frequencies are still a bit muddled. The difference is there, but I can understand why some people either don’t hear a difference or don’t think the difference is worth paying for. Going from the base model to the N1ZH is like going from Majik to Klimax. Everything about the sound is improved - the bass is much better resolved and the mids and highs are even cleaner. Stereo separation is much better too, producing a lovely 3D holographic sound. However, the greatest improvement is in the musicality which helps digital files to approach the musicality of a good vinyl setup. The difference isn’t small, and once heard is very difficult to return from. Some of the more vociferous members have claimed that a Klimax DS is basically the same as an Akurate with a fancy case and output transformers, and therefore not worth the extra money. What our fine upstanding members missed was that a KDS is way more musical than an Akurate, which is why it’s worth the money. The Melco’s have the same musical qualities which become more apparent with extended listening.

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2017-10-27, 10:37
Post: #15
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
" ... working closely with Linn ..."

Until we here something official from Linn I think it's safe to assume that this is marketing hyperbole!

Last t time I looked, Linn were using a Mac Mini as a NAS at the Factory along with standard Cat 6 cabling - to quote Ian Wilkinson "Just saying"!

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2017-10-27, 11:20
Post: #16
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
(2017-10-27 10:37)Donald Wrote:  " ... working closely with Linn ..."

Until we here something official from Linn I think it's safe to assume that this is marketing hyperbole!

Last t time I looked, Linn were using a Mac Mini as a NAS at the Factory along with standard Cat 6 cabling - to quote Ian Wilkinson "Just saying"!

I could equally say that it’s safe to assume that the reviewer wouldn’t lie because his integrity and professionalism is at stake. We know that Linn works behind the scenes with other manufacturers products, with and without the other manufacturers involvement. It makes a lot of sense for Linn to help steer Melco in the right direction.

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2017-10-27, 11:41
Post: #17
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
(2017-10-27 11:20)spannko Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 10:37)Donald Wrote:  " ... working closely with Linn ..."

Until we here something official from Linn I think it's safe to assume that this is marketing hyperbole!

Last t time I looked, Linn were using a Mac Mini as a NAS at the Factory along with standard Cat 6 cabling - to quote Ian Wilkinson "Just saying"!

I could equally say that it’s safe to assume that the reviewer wouldn’t lie because his integrity and professionalism is at stake. We know that Linn works behind the scenes with other manufacturers products, with and without the other manufacturers involvement. It makes a lot of sense for Linn to help steer Melco in the right direction.
If the Melco supports the OpenHome protocol that could be all there is to it. Looking at the hardware I doubt that Melco was paying that much attention.

They could easily have replaced the spinning disks with an array of SSDs and the folded SATA cable on top of the mainboard isn't exactly nice either. And no matter how you look at it, there are plenty of 'off-the-shelf' parts recognisable in the picture.
Compared to the previous iteration that MikeSpragg bought opened up this Melco already looks 'a bit nicer' but that shouldn't be the goal for such an expensive NAS.

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2017-10-27, 11:57
Post: #18
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
(2017-10-27 11:41)Tin Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 11:20)spannko Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 10:37)Donald Wrote:  " ... working closely with Linn ..."

Until we here something official from Linn I think it's safe to assume that this is marketing hyperbole!

Last t time I looked, Linn were using a Mac Mini as a NAS at the Factory along with standard Cat 6 cabling - to quote Ian Wilkinson "Just saying"!

I could equally say that it’s safe to assume that the reviewer wouldn’t lie because his integrity and professionalism is at stake. We know that Linn works behind the scenes with other manufacturers products, with and without the other manufacturers involvement. It makes a lot of sense for Linn to help steer Melco in the right direction.
If the Melco supports the OpenHome protocol that could be all there is to it. Looking at the hardware I doubt that Melco was paying that much attention.

They could easily have replaced the spinning disks with an array of SSDs and the folded SATA cable on top of the mainboard isn't exactly nice either. And no matter how you look at it, there are plenty of 'off-the-shelf' parts recognisable in the picture.
Compared to the previous iteration that MikeSpragg bought opened up this Melco already looks 'a bit nicer' but that shouldn't be the goal for such an expensive NAS.

The last time I looked in a KDS it was packed full with “off the shelf parts”. I really don’t understand your point.

It don't mean a thing (If it ain't got that swing)
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2017-10-27, 12:23
Post: #19
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
(2017-10-27 11:57)spannko Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 11:41)Tin Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 11:20)spannko Wrote:  
(2017-10-27 10:37)Donald Wrote:  " ... working closely with Linn ..."

Until we here something official from Linn I think it's safe to assume that this is marketing hyperbole!

Last t time I looked, Linn were using a Mac Mini as a NAS at the Factory along with standard Cat 6 cabling - to quote Ian Wilkinson "Just saying"!

I could equally say that it’s safe to assume that the reviewer wouldn’t lie because his integrity and professionalism is at stake. We know that Linn works behind the scenes with other manufacturers products, with and without the other manufacturers involvement. It makes a lot of sense for Linn to help steer Melco in the right direction.
If the Melco supports the OpenHome protocol that could be all there is to it. Looking at the hardware I doubt that Melco was paying that much attention.

They could easily have replaced the spinning disks with an array of SSDs and the folded SATA cable on top of the mainboard isn't exactly nice either. And no matter how you look at it, there are plenty of 'off-the-shelf' parts recognisable in the picture.
Compared to the previous iteration that MikeSpragg bought opened up this Melco already looks 'a bit nicer' but that shouldn't be the goal for such an expensive NAS.

The last time I looked in a KDS it was packed full with “off the shelf parts”. I really don’t understand your point.
In the review Melco claims that they do not use 'off the shelf parts'. They have a habbit of claiming things that aren't true, remember 'audiophile grade drives'?

Linn at least cut wires to the correct length instead of folding them together just because they found a 60cm cable on a shelf where only a 40cm one was required.

That may not be relevant for you, but to me it feels that Melco makes a lot of claims and when you pop the hood, it suddenly is just a pack of bull.
I never appreciated that.

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2017-10-27, 13:34
Post: #20
RE: Linn Co-develops Audiophile NAS
I just find these debates weird.
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